HomeMy WebLinkAbout1995-02-14 ad Hoc Haven Street Task Force MinutesCOMMONWEALTH OF MASSACHUSETTS
TOWN OF READING
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25 HAVEN STREET SALE
TASK FORCE
MINUTES OF DISCUSSION
Tuesday, February 14, 1995
Reading Town Hall
Reading, Massachusetts
Commence: 7:07 p.m.
Pages: 1 to 20
Reporter: Tracy D. Helms
DORIS M. JONES & ASSOCIATES, INC.
Professional Shorthand Reporters
59 Temple Place
Boston, Massachusetts 02111
(617) 542-0039
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APPEARANCES:
NAME
Philip Pacino,
as Chairman
William C. Brown
Willard Burditt
James Blomley
Leonard Rucker
Ted Cohen
Peter Hechenbleikner
AFFILIATION
Reading Municipal
Light Department
Citizen at Large
Selectman
RMLD, Assistant to
General Manager
RMLD, General Manager
Town Counsel
Town Manager, Town of
Reading
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P R O C E E D I N G S
MR. PACING: You want to start and
give us an outline.
MR. RUCKER: I'll ask you guys to
make sure T_ say everything accurate. The short
version was the task force at the last meeting asked
a variety of hypothetical questions, most of them
went away in terms of answers. When in the
conversation with Ted as town counsel and Ken Barna
as our general counsel, Peter, myself and Jim
Blomley participated it was discussed that the town
is obligated to use the Uniform Procurement Act.- So
that immediately eliminated a whole series of things
right off the bat.
The other key question that was asked is
could the process involve the process of an agent of
some sort as a marketing process. The answer is
yes, it can.
One of the other questions that was asked
is it required that the property be sold at
appraised value. The answer is no. You have to
follow the professional appraiser's process which is
the same sort of process. And if you sell for less
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than the appraised value, you need to notify the
Secretary of State, is it, you have to
MR. COHEN: Filed in the Central
Register.
MR. RUCKER: You have to document
your reasoning. And so, therefore, the most
restrictive thing going on at the moment is town
meeting vote. That's setting it at appraised value
seems simple. I think it covers a waterfront of all
the various questions asked. Did I say anything
incorrect there?
MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: No.
MR. COHEN: No.
MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: The idea of an
appraised value would be two things, one, town
meeting still has control of an amount below which
the property would not be sold and, secondly, you've
gotten in two rounds of bids. You've gotten
something above 80 percent of the appraised value.
Now the last time around it wasn't a qualified bid
and so forth, but presumably somebody is willing to
pay about that amount.
MR. PACINO: Bill.
MR. BURDITT: The one other concern
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1 we had was we did ask the highest bidder to come in
2 prior to the second rounds of bids to talk to him
3 about what he might do and to look for other things
1 that may be better for the town over and above the
5 sale price; and this doesn't do anything for that.
j MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: Right.
7 MR. BURDITT: This doesn't say we can
3 talk to any of the bidders that were not successful
3 bidders. Is there any way we can get something in
a that says that we can have a discussion? You know,
L we invited the guy there. He showed up and then
2 _everybody ran scared andsaid we can't talk to him
3 because we're going out to bid again.
I MR. COHEN: There is nothing that
i prevents you from talking to them or to anyone else,
3 and that was part part of the discussion we had
7 about if you were to use a broker to identify people
3 in the area and the state and the country who might
be interested in this. The bottom line is that
the before you award a contract there would have
L to be a bidding process under the Uniform
> Procurement Act. But that doesn't preclude you from
3 identifying possible bidders and discussing with
them what they might do for the town.
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Further, you could also structure RFP that
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goes out for bid as, you know, one of the elements.
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We're requiring certain things for the town.
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MR. HECHENBLEIKNER> Just as an
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example, bidding on both Bear Hill and Pearl Street
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School use Pearl as an example, it's a simpler
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one. We had bid it twice, got no qualified bids and
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the building was sitting there. We had somebody
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come to the town with the proposal, it happened to
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be Longwood with a broker. We said we're not paying
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the broker. If you want to, pay the broker, if
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that's-the deal you want to strike, that's fine; and
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they made a presentation -as to what they wanted to
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doe We talked with the board about it. The board,
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said fine. We went out to formal bid. They were
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one of two bidders. They happened to be the only
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qualified bidder. They wound up with the deal.
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MR. BURDITT: What I'm coming from
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is I think what I'm coming from I think our hands
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are still tied at the 80 percent limit. Say
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somebody came in say they wanted to make us an
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offer, and they would take the building down and
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they would give us something that would be five
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times whatever we thought we were getting in taxable
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revenue; but if they haven't offered 80 percent of
the
MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: Appraised value.
MR. BURDITT: appraised value, we
can't even I wouldn't feel there is nothing we
could do about it. We couldn't sell to them, and it
could be a wonderful, tremendous thing for the town;
and we can't talk to them if it's not 80 percent of
the appraised value.
MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: Or you could run
out and call a special town meeting to make a
presentation.
MR. BURDITT: You could, but I think
what we had hoped to do was to get some language so
that we could avoid that. We had hoped we could get
something in here that said we're not going to give
the building away. We would like the opportunity.
I think -the 80 percent still limits us as the 100
percent limited us. Is there a possibility to get
something 80 percent or whatever would bring the
town a building that would give us excess of what
the tax revenue would be at 80 percent, you know,
something like that that allows us to talk to see
what else we might get?
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MR. RUCKER: Can I ask a question?
MR. PACINO: Go ahead.
MR. RUCKER: I guess it's to Ted and
I was just trying to see if in here and I'm not
suggesting this, I'm just asking a question. If
it's possible if you remove the bold stroke
capitalized words in the draft. Wait just a second
for Ted to get to the page. Which says for an
amount not less than 80 percent and the and the
subsequent word and then it would be upon such terms
and conditions.
MR. COHEN: The language about the
minimum amount
MR. BURDITT: Mm-hmm.
MR. COHEN: is not strictly
necessary. As I was explaining there are a couple
of statutes. The statute we're relating to is sale
of property that was acquired by taking. It
requires that you specify a minimum amount. This
property which was acquired by purchase does not,
strictly speaking, require that. However, it has
been a policy in the town for probably at least the
last 15 or more years to specify a minimum amount in
every authorization for sale.
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So what Len is suggesting is indeed
possible. I mean, that's a political thing. If you
all want to stand up before town meeting and explain
to them why you're taking it out and get town
meeting to agree to it, legally you can do it.
In our discussion the other day I think I
was the one who suggested the 80 percent because
that was pretty much the figure that your bids have
come in at. As a means of leaving something in so
that town meeting doesn't feel that you're giving
things away and that things are totally open ended.
I mean, you know what town _ meeting is like
nowadays You know, maybe they would say fine,_ You
know, we trust the --light -board and the Board of
Selectmen to agree to an appropriate amount.
MR. BURDITT: I don't mind the 80
percent being in there. But what I would like is
still the ability to
MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: Do a qualitative
evaluation instead of quantitative.
MR. BURDITT: to get more in tax
revenues or something that wouldn't give us the 80
percent of the sale value.
MR. COHEN: I mean, perhaps you could
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do something for an amount in money or other goods
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or services.
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MR. BURDITT: Or future tax revenue
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or something like that.
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MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: Your feeling was
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somebody might buy the building now and might pay
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$10,000 here in property taxes and pay, you know,
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375,000 or somebody might buy the property, demolish
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the building, put something up that would pay
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$50,000 a year in property tax and you would like to
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be able to evaluate something against the other; and
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the long-term example is for us the problem the
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light board is going to have with that. They don't-
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get_ the taxes.- They get the =cash. So .hat's part
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of what they would have to evaluate>
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MR. BURDITT: I know.
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MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: It's a joint
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decision. So the light board would have the input
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into that.
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MR. BURDITT: Part of what Mollie
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wanted last week was to have two numbers in here;
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one is with the building demolished and the other
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was with the building up, two sale prices.
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MR. RUCKER: The only potential
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1 problem with that is somebody has got to pay to
2 demolish the building.
3 MR. BURDITT: I understand. Somebody
4 says I'll give you $50,000 and I'll tear the
5 building down. If the land value is 50,000, it
6 should be sold at 50,000. Again, this is better
7 than that.
8 MR. RUCKER: The reason I was asking
9 the question to Ted is my observation would be if
10 that was removed, assuming that the political
11 decision was to do that, and town meeting went along
12 with it, then it leaves the control in that both the
13 Board of Sele-c_tmen have o_ne, set of objectives and
14 the Municipal Light Board which have a different set
15 of objectives after both agree. So it was a check
16 and balance that occurs right in there.
17 MR. FACINO< And the problem you run
18 into is the same problem you ran into before. The
19 appraised value was put in by the finance
20 committee. The finance committee came forward and
21 was very concerned about property going for less
22 than value. And it's a concern that is out there in
23 town meeting. I mean, that's the problem with
24 removing some sort of controls in the town meeting
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that they
feel they
can at least try to guide the
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process,
so both.
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MR.
RUCKER: It's a devil's advocate
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argument.
This is
an interesting problem with the
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general m
anager. T
he devil's advocate argument
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would be
that twice
it's been tried and it didn't
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work, but
more impo
rtantly the ratepayers' point of
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view. In
fact, the
carrying cost of this is being
born 100
percent by
the ratepayers. And it's an
increase
in cost.
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MR.
BROWN: And loss of tax revenue
to the town.
MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: By not selling
i MR. BROWN: By not selling it.
i MR. RUCKER: I was looking at it from
the light department.
3 MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: It's not good
for town.
MR. RUCKER: 65,000 a year.
MR. PACINO: Is there a way to
! convert the bold letters to some sort of guideline,
the suggested guideline?
MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: One of the
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things that you could do I think, Ted, is if you did
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what Len said and take the phrase out, then it gives
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you more latitude in terms of the motion so that the
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motion could come back and say 80 percent or 70
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percent or 40 percent. I mean as long as it's
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MR. RUCKER: Or the board and
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commission could meet separately to establish the
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criteria.
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MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: You would have
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between now and April 10 to decide exactly what the
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motion should say,.
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MR. PACINO: Interesting point maybe
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in. terms of havi_i-ig the motion strike that and then
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have the commission and the board meet and et--__a
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guideline and say this is what the guideline is,,
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MR. RUCKER: I think you have to
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reach an accommodation because ultimately it takes
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both your votes if you don't find an accommodation.
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MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: I suggest you
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take FinCom into that meeting also.
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MR. PACINO: Obviously.
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MR. RUCKER: To me what it does is it
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leaves you a clean slate to then see what's
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MR. COHEN: Right now it says not
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less than appraised value. What you're taking it
down to is zero. What you're basically doing is
taking it down to zero, and I think we could amend
it.
MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: Where could you
make the motion to?
MR. COHEN: I think we could.
MR. RUCKER: I don't think it really
comes down to I understand the zero. Politically
with the selectmen and commission you are going to
have two different objectives; and ultimately, I
think the political process itself between the two
boards will come to some reasonable
MR. PACING: What I would see is the
time that this article is presented to own meeting
as presented as part of it a separate package
showing these are the guidelines the two boards have
agreed on, boom.
MR.
information on the
building, what the
MR.
MR.
MR.
HECHENBLEIKNER: As well as
history of what happened with the
bids were.
PACING: Yes.
BURDITT: Yes.
HECHENBLEIKNER: So town meeting
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has background. I think when this was passed
MR. RUCKER: That's exactly right.
When this was initially approved, why would you not
have asked for the appraised value. Now you bid it
twice and have some experience you can go back to
town meeting and say, well, look, we have a white
elephant here that won't go for the appraised value.
MR. BURDITT: Right.
MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: I think it does
go to the concerns Bill has. Part of that package
can be some qualitative elements to it also in terms
of whether it's job creation, tax benefit and so
forth,
MR. BROWN: Iagree.
MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: That would be
part of the mix.
MR. COHEN: Actually, we would need
to change something else I think because we've got
here using a written appraisal prepared by a
qualified commercial property appraisal firm to
determine the minimum amount to be paid for such
conveyance.
MR. BURDITT: I think we can still
use that.
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MR. PACINO: I think that can stay.
MR. COHEN: We can still use the term
minimum amount.
MR. BURDITT: I don't know about
using minimum amount, maybe take that out; but I
think we can use the appraised value.
MR. COHEN: You have to under the
Uniform Procurement Act you have to have an
appraisal done.
MR. BURDITT: And we've done that.
I'm saying leave that out. I don't know about the
m_izzimum
MR..PACINO: I would leave that in.
MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: Say fair market
value as opposed to the minimum amount because
you're already you're below that, you're saying
taking out -the minimum amount.
MR. RUCKER: Remove minimum, put fair
market.
MR. PACINO: Put fair remove
minimum. Put fair.
MR. COHEN: Take out minimum to
determine the amount to be paid for such conveyance.
MR. PACING: Okay.
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MR. BURDITT: Yes. Yes.
MR. COHEN: Upon such terms and
conditions.
MR. RUCKER: Those deletions I think
just give the selectmen and the light board maximum
flexibility. 4
MR. PACING: Mm-hmm.
MR. HECHENBLEIKNER: Then when you
draft the motion
MR. BURDITT: What we need to do is
be within the bounds I think is the word. Is that
right, Ted, for what we do tonight?
MR COHEN:- Righte
MR. HECHENBLEIKN'ER: But between now -
and town meeting light board, FinCom and the Board
of Selectmen meet and determine what the motion will
say, and it may say 80 percent or it may not say 80
percent; but credit will be given for taxable value
or I mean, you know
MR. BURDITT: Yeah.
MR. RUCKER: I think as long as it
says Board of Selectmen and Municipal Light Board
you've got your check and balances.
MR. PACINO: Right.
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I think, yeah.
MR. COHEN: I was just going to say
by deleting the word minimum and by deleting the
phrase for an amount not less than the appraised
value and you so it would then read so and so and
so forth and using a written appraisal prepared by a
qualified commercial property appraisal firm to
determine the amount to be paid for such conveyance;
and to authorize the Board of Selectmen and
Municipal Light Board to convey all or any part of
such property upon such terms and conditions as the
Board of Selectmen and the Mu-nic-ipal- Light Board
shall consider proper:a
MR PACINO: Okay.
MR. RUCKER: And you can go to the
political process before the meeting.
MR. PACINO: Right.
MR. RUCKER: Which incidently I won't
be here for town meeting.
(Discussion off record)
MR. PACINO: At this point, I mean,
from the last meeting we can't formally take a
vote because we're not an official quorum. I think
in the last meeting, the last meeting kind of
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